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Post by jdrudge on Mar 28, 2012 16:46:28 GMT 7
This was bought as N. thorelii from a collector whose collections mainly consisted of plants originating from Exotica Plants. I've been hunting around and the closest I can seem to find is N. mirabilis. It has very papery leaves and traps. The leaves are distinctly veined with 2 or 3 longitudinal veins within the leaf margins. The less-mature leaves are broader with distinct tooth-like hairs along the margins. The new leaves are hairy all over; older leaves are hairy along the midrib. Can anyone offer any suggestions of what it may be? Thanks Attachments:
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Post by jdrudge on Mar 28, 2012 16:56:01 GMT 7
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Post by Dave Evans on Mar 29, 2012 4:28:23 GMT 7
Looks like a fairly annoyed N. smilesii.
It is not N. thorelii nor N. mirabilis.
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Post by marcello catalano on Mar 29, 2012 8:22:52 GMT 7
yes, smilesii
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Post by jdrudge on Mar 31, 2012 6:16:01 GMT 7
Thanks for your responses Marcello and Dave. One thing that's got me stumped is that the earlier leaves on each stem have fimbriate margins. The descriptions I've read of N. smilesii don't seem to mention this characteristic, which I'm guessing is quite distinctive. There are some more photos of the plant, including the leaves with fimbriate margins, here: picasaweb.google.com/117870504521195444581/NThorelii?authkey=Gv1sRgCJHTmbXfzaDkqgE |
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Post by marcello catalano on Mar 31, 2012 6:19:50 GMT 7
the fimbriate margins appear on most seedlings, and occasionally they appear on "protoleaves" too. With protoleaves I mean the leaves growing after some kind of shock, change, pruning etc, like in your case.
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Post by Dave Evans on Mar 31, 2012 7:15:00 GMT 7
I believe this is a trait left over from when Nepenthes were proto-Nepenthes and they probably didn't have pitchers. Probably left over from when they were more like Drosera...
Those frimbriations were using again by Nepenthes, but on the wings of the lowers pitchers of most species.
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Post by jdrudge on Mar 31, 2012 10:53:34 GMT 7
Awesome - thanks heaps guys!!!!!!!
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Post by jdrudge on Apr 10, 2012 4:25:54 GMT 7
A response from EP:
"If this plant originated from us then it could only be one of a number of atypical N.bokorensis plants that germinated from seed we were sent. Rather then sell them as N.bokorensis or destroy them, we sold them in hanging pots to a few general nurseries. I don't know where the N.thorelii label came from but it wouldn't have been what we labeled the plant as."
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Post by Dave Evans on Apr 10, 2012 5:26:28 GMT 7
I'm not sure it is from EP. Looks rather simlar to this plant: www.rci.rutgers.edu/~dpevans/Nepenthes/N_smilesii.htmWhich has been labeled as "thorelii" for as long as it has been in cultivation... Not sure if there are companies still putting out N. smilesii as "N. thorelii", but there still plenty of plants in various collections with the wrong names on their lables... We are talking about plants sold 40 something years ago. The only thing which is throwing me off with your plant is the petiole seems rather well developed for N. smilesii, but the thin leaves and pitcher shape are dead on for N. smilesii. |
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Post by marcello catalano on Apr 10, 2012 9:58:48 GMT 7
Jdrudge, that's an obvious and very typical smilesii, nothing to do with bokorensis or any other species of the group, if EP never had this species, than your plant is from another source. You can check plenty of photos on the web and even ask François, who described bokorensis and who's going to work on smilesii too. We've seen plenty of those in the wild, and their variability can be much more problematic than in your plant  ... |
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Post by jdrudge on Apr 10, 2012 13:11:48 GMT 7
Hey Marcello,
You and Dave had me convinced that it is N.smilesii - I just wanted to share what the EP people said. I'm trying to help it look a little less "annoyed" (as Dave had described it, above), by nursing it with some higher humidity, and see how it goes despite the imminent Sydney winter.
Thanks again
All your comments have really helped - I was really stumped before.
Jeff
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Post by marcello catalano on Apr 10, 2012 18:47:26 GMT 7
ah, for the less annoyed look that this species often takes in cultivation, the best option is to put it under much harsher conditions: less humidity, drier soil and as much direct sun as possible. Do it gradually, but you will be surprised by how much this species can be grown like a cactus. It will get more colorful and less fluffy. And put food in the pitchers!
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Post by Dave Evans on Apr 13, 2012 3:38:30 GMT 7
I'm not sure about the drier soil part, but my N. smilesii have no problem with household humidity, one of the exceptions in the genus. Which it also tend to give to the hybrids, an extremely beneficial trait to inherit.
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Post by jdrudge on Apr 18, 2012 13:39:37 GMT 7
Cool! A couple of things I can try there. Fortunately I've got two of these so I can experiment a little
Thanks again Dave and Marcello!
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